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Joe Boozell | sifoeeprocess.com | January 16, 2018

Deandre Ayton vs. Marvin Bagley: The great debate

  Deandre Ayton is averaging 20.5 points and 11.9 rebounds this season for Arizona.

Arizona forward Deandre Ayton and Duke forward Marvin Bagley will likely be compared to one another for a long time.

They鈥檙e both transcendent talents. Ayton and Bagley have been the best players on bluebloods that feature experienced college stars like Allonzo Trier and Grayson Allen.

They鈥檙e also incredibly similar, both in style and in statistical output. Their numbers are nearly identical:

Ayton vs. Bagley per game stats
Player Points Rebounds Assists Blocks FG% 3FG% FT%
Ayton 20.5 11.9 1.6 1.3 60.9 28.6 69.4
Bagley 21.3 11.3 1.5 0.9 61.1 33.3 61.1

But there are subtle differences between them. Let鈥檚 break down two of the most talented big men we鈥檝e seen in college basketball in recent years.

Strength/Athleticism

At 7-1, 250 pounds, Ayton is a house, and he plays like one. And unlike a lot of guys that size, he鈥檚 extraordinarily fluid; Ayton moves like a guard.

There are big men across the country who have Ayton鈥檚 athleticism, but none pair it with his caliber of strength. Ayton displays both on this play.

Oh dear. Big men flush alley-oops frequently; rarely are they coordinated enough to do so with a running head start like Ayton has here. With apologies to Greg Oden (as strong but not quite as athletic) and Anthony Davis (more athletic, but rail-thin), you鈥檇 probably have to go back to Blake Griffin鈥檚 Oklahoma days to find a big man with the kind of strength and explosiveness combination Ayton has.

Ayton is a notch above Bagley here, too 鈥 he鈥檚 wiry, and about as athletic as Ayton. But he鈥檚 not nearly as filled out. Bagley has elite body control and outstanding hands for a guy his size 鈥 he looks like an All-American tight end going up for loose balls, and his rebounding radius is insane. That was all on display in this 30-point, 15-rebound performance against Florida:

Bagley is a freak. Ayton is whatever the level above 鈥渇reak鈥 is.

Slight edge: Ayton

Shooting

Ayton鈥檚 pet move is his face-up midrange jumper 鈥 perhaps even to a fault. It鈥檚 not a high efficiency shot; even if Ayton cans 50 percent of those, he鈥檇 be better served if he stepped out and hit 3s at a 35 percent clip.

Ayton鈥檚 range isn鈥檛 reliable yet, but he has feathery touch. The face-up mid-range jumper is also inefficient because, frankly, it鈥檚 a hard shot to make. Ayton drains it frequently, and that speaks to his shooting chops. He鈥檚 only shooting 29 percent from 3 but Ayton has made four of his last 10 attempts. He鈥檚 shooting a respectable 69 percent from the line, so it feels like that range will come with time. Ayton鈥檚 stroke is textbook:

Bagley is shooting 33 percent from 3 but does much more of his damage near the hoop as opposed to the mid range. He鈥檚 also shooting just 61 percent from the free-throw line, which is a bit of an issue considering Bagley鈥檚 relentless interior style. He鈥檚 going to get there a lot. Bagley would be scoring at an even higher rate if he shot free-throws at a normal clip.

Bagley鈥檚 jumper isn鈥檛 broken, by any means. But he鈥檚 not as fluid, or quick in his release as Ayton. This off-the-bounce 3 goes in, but his shot is a bit flat, and he takes some time to wind up.

Bagley鈥檚 outside shot has actually been better than advertised. But Ayton is a bit ahead of him at this point.

Slight edge: Ayton

Post play

If we鈥檙e saying Ayton is a better shooter, but Bagley scores just as much as him 鈥 guess what that means? The latter is better on the interior.

Bagley鈥檚 motor just runs so hot. Effort was a knock on Ayton coming into college 鈥 but it鈥檚 kind of hard to see why; he鈥檚 been outstanding for Arizona, and there鈥檚 been no evidence of him dogging it. But Bagley鈥檚 maximum effort jumps off of the screen.

By the same logic used above, Ayton is more physically imposing than Bagley, but their rebounding numbers are eerily similar. Bagley has an endless bag of post tricks; he鈥檚 able to contort his body in ways that guys his size shouldn鈥檛 be able to, and he鈥檚 so athletic that his shot rarely gets blocked.

Ayton and Bagley are both monsters down low. But Duke鈥檚 rookie is more consistently dominant.

Edge: Bagley

Passing

It鈥檚 probably too early to tell, to be honest. Ayton and Bagley are so physically overwhelming that the right basketball play is usually for them to try to score the ball themselves, regardless of who鈥檚 on them.

They鈥檒l face more double-teams as the season wears on. For what it鈥檚 worth, they both saw them in their last game 鈥 Bagley against Boston College, and Ayton against Alabama. Each had one assist, but Bagley had four turnovers to Ayton鈥檚 two, and is coughing it up more frequently in general.

Keep an eye on this moving forward. Defenses will start to adapt, and Bagley and Ayton could find open 3-point shooters often if it鈥檚 something they prioritize.

Edge: Draw

Rebounding

The raw numbers are nearly identical, but dig a little deeper, and this gets complicated.

Duke ranks 55th in adjusted tempo. Arizona ranks 190th. Therefore, Bagley has had more opportunities to grab rebounds than Ayton 鈥 and their rebounding rates reflect as much. Ayton has collected 30.8 percent of available defensive rebounds when he鈥檚 on the floor, the ninth-highest mark in the country. Bagley鈥檚 defensive rebounding rate is 23.7, which ranks 115th. For what it鈥檚 worth, Bagley鈥檚 offensive rebounding rate is higher, but only by a smidge.

There鈥檚 some noise here. Bagley鈥檚 frontcourt partner is Wendell Carter, who鈥檚 a significantly better rebounder that Dusan Ristic, Ayton鈥檚 frontcourt partner. And Duke is rebounding better as a team than Arizona; the Blue Devils are first in offensive rebounding and 144th in defensive rebounding; the Wildcats are 76th and 121st. Bagley鈥檚 offensive rebounding is part of the reason why Duke has the No. 1 offense in the country, and rebounding isn鈥檛 all about individual totals. Sometimes, a quality boxout to ensure a teammate snags the rock is just as good as an actual board.

This is the closest category yet. Even though Ayton has been a slightly more impressive individual rebounder, Bagley鈥檚 ferocious second-chance efforts have propped up Duke鈥檚 offense. Side note: it usually doesn鈥檛 matter, but Ayton rarely boxes out, and Bagley at least makes an effort.

Slight, slight, slight edge: Bagley

Defense

For as good as these guys are on offense, their defense leaves some to be desired.

Given their athleticism, it鈥檚 shocking that Bagley averages less than a block per game and Ayton is barely over a block per game. Duke鈥檚 defense has been a mess 鈥 it鈥檚 ranked 70th 鈥 and while there鈥檚 way more to that than Bagley, he hasn鈥檛 been a difference-maker on that end.

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And it鈥檚 fair to criticize Ayton for attempting to pad his rebounding totals, meaning he often pulls up on shots he could potentially alter or swat. Arizona has been better than Duke defensively, but the Wildcats still rank just 54th 鈥 given the personnel, both teams should be better on that side of the floor. Bagley is more agile side-to-side and better at containing guards, while Ayton is a more effective rim-protector. But their offensive transcendence hasn鈥檛 translated to defense. Perhaps it will in time; both guys have the tools to be dominant two-way players.

To settle the debate, we dove into the on-off court splits. Duke is essentially the same defensively with or without Bagley 鈥 the Blue Devils allow about a point less per 100 possessions with him in the game. Arizona, on the other hand, is clearly better with Ayton on the floor 鈥 the Wildcats surrender about five less points per 100 possessions with their freshman manning the lane.

Defense is usually harder to learn on the college level than offense. Ayton and Bagley will pick up defensive concepts in the coming months, and be better for it.

But for now, Ayton is slightly more important to his team鈥檚 defense than Bagley.

Edge: Ayton

Overall edge: Ayton, ever so slightly. But it's so close that it could flip on a game-by-game basis.

What tremendous talents these two are.

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